Dan Rather's Situation
The Situation with Tucker Carlson
MSNBC
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TUCKER CARLSON, MSNBC HOST: Welcome back. That was Jimmy Swaggart — I mean, sorry, that was — excuse me, that was Dan Rather almost two years ago, apologizing for his role in a discredited report on President Bush's National Guard service. That moment marked the beginning of the end of his long career at CBS News.
Well, now Rather is back with a new series on HDNet, the high definition cable network co-founded by Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban. But the question remains, was Rather a target of the organized right, or was he just a sloppy journalist?
Joining me he to answer that question, Matthew Sheffield. He's the executive editor of newsbusters.org, also the co-founder of ratherbias.com.
Matthew Sheffield, thanks for coming on.
Thanks for having me, Tucker.
CARLSON: So, conservatives have been after Dan Rather for these many decades. A lot of liberals in the press, why Dan Rather? I mean, how do we know Dan Rather is a screaming liberal?
SHEFFIELD: Well, you just look at what he says, quite honestly. I mean, he — if you compare what he says about Republicans and you compare what he says about Democrats, he pretty much — the only bad thing he ever says about Democrats is they're not liberal enough. And he said that about Bill Clinton when he did welfare reform. He was, like, so, they're going to push — he's pushing a law that's going to, by anyone's analysis, put poor children into the streets.
And then with you look at what he says about Republicans, it's just they're evil, they're taking over the world, they're destroying the Constitution. And blah, blah, blah, blah.
CARLSON: So — but you're — you're — in other words, you're inferring from his comments, what you believe are editorial comments, his political views, his own political views.
SHEFFIELD: Exactly.
CARLSON: But has he ever come out and said, you know, “I'm a Democrat, I support Democrats”? Has he ever been more explicit about it?
SHEFFIELD: Well, he actually did when he was in college. He was the editor of a student paper there, and he wrote a column, and he said, “Why I Am a Democrat.”
Democrats are the party of the people, and he just went on a long schpiel about that. And nobody has ever actually confronted him about that on the air, those former statements. And everybody who knows him at CBS, we had a number of people over the years contact us, and they agreed very much that Dan was liberal, even though he would never admit it.
CARLSON: Right. And, of course, he spoke at a Democratic Party fund-raiser in Texas…
SHEFFIELD: Exactly. Exactly.
CARLSON: …not all that long ago.
Now, to the — to the incidents that effectively ended his career in broadcast television, did he ever — did he ever concede — we just played the sort of apology a minute ago, but did he ever concede that the report, the documents that he used to attack Bush's service in the National Guard, or lack of it, that they were phony? Did he ever admit that, it was it a made up story?
SHEFFIELD: No, he actually never has admitted that outright. They said — he said — the official line is, “The documents cannot be authenticated.” And that, you know, can mean anything other than — it can mean they're true, we think they're true.
It can mean they're false. It can mean we think they're true, but we couldn't prove they're true. I mean, it's a very legalistic denial, really. So it's a non-apology apology, essentially.
CARLSON: Right. But we know I think conclusively, I believe conclusively, in any case, that they were false.
Is this such a bad idea, though, that he's going to HDNet? I mean, the complaint has always been, you know, the big three networks are liberal and they come into our houses, we don't pay for them, they kind of force themselves upon us and they push their point of view on us and we resent it. Therefore, we create FOX News, or whatever. But that's always been the complaint, correct?
But this is really narrow casting. I mean, this is going to be essentially a service. If you're liberal and you want to watch Dan Rather, you pay for it, and you can. Or you pull him up and you can.
I mean, that's not bad, is it?
SHEFFIELD: Yes. Well, more power to him. But it just shows that, you know, that's the kind of audience that he has left.
I mean, you know, if you look at the ratings for “CBS Evening News” over the — over his tenure, there was a steady trend downward. And after he left, the ratings have gone up.
So, I mean, there — there are probably some people out there that would want to watch it. But I somehow suspect that they're not out buying HDTVs.
CARLSON: All right. Well, I guess we'll get a chance to see.
Matthew Sheffield, thanks a lot for joining us.
SHEFFIELD: A pleasure.
MSNBC
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAN RATHER, JOURNALIST: I made a mistake. I didn't did hard enough, long enough, didn't ask enough of the right questions. And I trusted a source who changed his story. It turns out he misled us, lied to us about one thing.(END VIDEO CLIP)
But there are no excuses. This is not a day for excuses. I made a mistake, we made a mistake, and I'm sorry for it.
TUCKER CARLSON, MSNBC HOST: Welcome back. That was Jimmy Swaggart — I mean, sorry, that was — excuse me, that was Dan Rather almost two years ago, apologizing for his role in a discredited report on President Bush's National Guard service. That moment marked the beginning of the end of his long career at CBS News.
Well, now Rather is back with a new series on HDNet, the high definition cable network co-founded by Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban. But the question remains, was Rather a target of the organized right, or was he just a sloppy journalist?
Joining me he to answer that question, Matthew Sheffield. He's the executive editor of newsbusters.org, also the co-founder of ratherbias.com.
Matthew Sheffield, thanks for coming on.
Thanks for having me, Tucker.
CARLSON: So, conservatives have been after Dan Rather for these many decades. A lot of liberals in the press, why Dan Rather? I mean, how do we know Dan Rather is a screaming liberal?
SHEFFIELD: Well, you just look at what he says, quite honestly. I mean, he — if you compare what he says about Republicans and you compare what he says about Democrats, he pretty much — the only bad thing he ever says about Democrats is they're not liberal enough. And he said that about Bill Clinton when he did welfare reform. He was, like, so, they're going to push — he's pushing a law that's going to, by anyone's analysis, put poor children into the streets.
And then with you look at what he says about Republicans, it's just they're evil, they're taking over the world, they're destroying the Constitution. And blah, blah, blah, blah.
CARLSON: So — but you're — you're — in other words, you're inferring from his comments, what you believe are editorial comments, his political views, his own political views.
SHEFFIELD: Exactly.
CARLSON: But has he ever come out and said, you know, “I'm a Democrat, I support Democrats”? Has he ever been more explicit about it?
SHEFFIELD: Well, he actually did when he was in college. He was the editor of a student paper there, and he wrote a column, and he said, “Why I Am a Democrat.”
Democrats are the party of the people, and he just went on a long schpiel about that. And nobody has ever actually confronted him about that on the air, those former statements. And everybody who knows him at CBS, we had a number of people over the years contact us, and they agreed very much that Dan was liberal, even though he would never admit it.
CARLSON: Right. And, of course, he spoke at a Democratic Party fund-raiser in Texas…
SHEFFIELD: Exactly. Exactly.
CARLSON: …not all that long ago.
Now, to the — to the incidents that effectively ended his career in broadcast television, did he ever — did he ever concede — we just played the sort of apology a minute ago, but did he ever concede that the report, the documents that he used to attack Bush's service in the National Guard, or lack of it, that they were phony? Did he ever admit that, it was it a made up story?
SHEFFIELD: No, he actually never has admitted that outright. They said — he said — the official line is, “The documents cannot be authenticated.” And that, you know, can mean anything other than — it can mean they're true, we think they're true.
It can mean they're false. It can mean we think they're true, but we couldn't prove they're true. I mean, it's a very legalistic denial, really. So it's a non-apology apology, essentially.
CARLSON: Right. But we know I think conclusively, I believe conclusively, in any case, that they were false.
Is this such a bad idea, though, that he's going to HDNet? I mean, the complaint has always been, you know, the big three networks are liberal and they come into our houses, we don't pay for them, they kind of force themselves upon us and they push their point of view on us and we resent it. Therefore, we create FOX News, or whatever. But that's always been the complaint, correct?
But this is really narrow casting. I mean, this is going to be essentially a service. If you're liberal and you want to watch Dan Rather, you pay for it, and you can. Or you pull him up and you can.
I mean, that's not bad, is it?
SHEFFIELD: Yes. Well, more power to him. But it just shows that, you know, that's the kind of audience that he has left.
I mean, you know, if you look at the ratings for “CBS Evening News” over the — over his tenure, there was a steady trend downward. And after he left, the ratings have gone up.
So, I mean, there — there are probably some people out there that would want to watch it. But I somehow suspect that they're not out buying HDTVs.
CARLSON: All right. Well, I guess we'll get a chance to see.
Matthew Sheffield, thanks a lot for joining us.
SHEFFIELD: A pleasure.
Labels: Media bias
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